lesbotronic

I only want to meet other women that are REAL!

57 posts in this topic

After reading a LOT of profiles that specify this as a requirement . . . we think we really don't know what "REAL" actually means.

Well. We can sort of imagine those specifying this don't wish to be with someone who lies on a regular basis, or ever lies about anything really important.

Like, don't say you're a licensed veterinarian, then when someone asks you about their cat's emergency medical problem say WHOOPS, oh no, I'm not actually a vet at all, I have no idea about your kitty. Uh Oh! Sorry I'm such an ass that I lied!

Or SURE, I didn't have any alcohol today, I'm fine to drive except WHOOPS, now I wrecked the car because I'm a big lying drunkiepants and now I'm going to jail. Nope!

Or, I'm totally single, I'm totally free to date whomever I like except WHOOPS there's my girlfriend/husband/whatever and I gotta go!

Not good either.

But if lying is the bad thing, why not just ask for someone that is honest? The liars might still respond ('cause that's what liars will do), but at least you'd be clear that's what you meant.

Other than the avoidance of big huge lies, what does "REAL" actually mean?

If someone doesn't tell lies, are they "REAL?" Is that enough?

If not, then what else does it mean?

Can someone who is not "REAL" get that way later? What exactly would that entail?

Thinking about whomever you imagine to NOT be "REAL" . . . would they agree with you?

Would anyone that is NOT "REAL" agree that that is so?

Or does every human on the planet imagine themselves to be "REAL?"

Thoughts and clarifications most appreciated, thanks.

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I took this to mean that it's a preference for cisgendered women, and so the profile owner would not be interested in dating MTFs. I take it as a type of transphobia, but I could be reading it wrong.

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Thanks for responding, RedFish. You know, that's an excellent hypothesis. And it's likely correct for some of the profiles.

But we have about 4000 profiles saying something along the lines of the above. Somehow it seems more . . . basic or personality-based, for many.

Also, the site profiles already clearly allow you to specify yourself as cisgendered and that you only wish to hear from other cisgendered subscribers, if you so choose. This is not to say that some subscribers might still express some transphobic sentiment in their profiles anyhow, but it's just so . . . unnecessary, you know?

I mean, you already do NOT have to hear from anyone trans if you don't wanna. No need to natter on and on about it ANYWAY.

But yeah, transphobia, probably an issue for some. Still wondering about the rest . . .

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I think the whole "real" thing may just be a response to the recent cultural backlash against superficiality. Not that long ago you couldn't be considered attractive without fakery. Fake breasts, fake noses, botox, laser optic, capped teeth, not to mention an off the shelf attitude and personality.

About the time that the economy started tanking, suddenly people started being offended by all the fake faces, fake bodies, and fake personalities and started shifting their attention to less plastic people.

Hollywood and television started importing actors from the UK to get a few faces which hadn't been surgically altered to look identical to every other actor's face. It started to be easier to sell things with the idea of reality than with the idea of fantasy. Now this is just a pendulum swing like every other mass phenomenon, but while it is heaving in this direction, people in general will associate cool with real and fake with uncool.

Since most people don't think about this sort of thing and instead just regurgitate whatever semantic bits are most common in their social group at any given time, it seems very likely that statements about "real" things being desirable would be common place.

But maybe I'm just over thinking it?

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Thanks for your responses, Farandolae and Rural Technophile. 

Quote
From my perspective, the only way to know for sure is to ask and see if there are patterns in the responses. Which I'm sure you all have time to do - not.

 

Yeah, we'd have to do a massive email on that, and compile the responses. We've got some inner research nerd going on too (else, why would we even wonder?) but no, no enough time for that right now. We've done a massive email request for feedback and compiled responses in the past for some previous questions that seemed important, mainly about some of the stuff on the profile questionnaire. Sadly, right NOW, just the general site maintenance and new profile approval has us pretty slammed and exhausted. We were really hoping some of those who insisted on the "realness" might clarify their perspective here. But obviously so far, not so much.

Rural Technophile, very fascinating perspective! A shift within Hollywood and subsequent TV programming in relation to the economy hadn't occurred to us at all. Hmmmm. I guess we HADN'T thought about that sort of thing. ?? But if that's "over thinking," please do keep it up, it's marvelous. :)

We were also wondering if "realness" was something that could be more objectively or specifically defined on the part of those requesting it . . . or if it was more like we've come to view "sense of humor." Meaning, that everyone seems to think they have a "good" sense of humor, such that requesting someone that does in a personals profile is virtually meaningless. The only thing to do is be more specific about what you mean by "good," then look for that, such that the descriptive phrase, "good sense of humor" then becomes fairly useless.

But again, still pretty confused about "realness," since the massive insistence that one must possess it is relatively new for us, profile review-wise.

Thanks again for your feedback!

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Mm, I've a few times seen people on message boards mention bad experiences with dating sites (certain ones being named as specifically bad) in terms of lots of profiles being literally fake; usually, a particular kind of man masquerading as female to fulfil xyz creepy desire - ogle specifically lesbian women, try to strike up lesbian sexychat, even lure someone out into public, whatever. I've not generally got the impression that the people in question were making disgusting references to trans women, but people who identify as men who want to prey on queer women in some sense.

... Other than that, yeah, I'm sure transphobia accounts for a number. And perhaps often "real" as a synonym for "genuine"? Which is still pretty nebulous, but I'd have thought usually lies somewhere in the realm of: no bullshit&lies, no hidden agendas, no power games, no pretensions etc. I'd have thought that most people with any significant relationship history to speak of would've come across at least one aspect of all that at some point (more, certainly, than will have knowingly had any romantic experiences with any trans people - and those that have known anyone trans to any significant degree are, I'm fairly sure, less likely to spew that kind of bigotry anyway), which I'd have thought would go some way to explaining its prevalence.

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OK, still interested in exploring this, since the profiles expressing concern regarding "REAL" do keep pouring in.

To review, the lovely peeps that have been clever enough to comment thus far have expressed a variety of opinions on what "REAL" actually means, either for those wanting to meet others that are "REAL," declaring oneself "REAL," or both. Those include:

1. people who do not lie, at least not very often, or about anything important

2. NOT males (assigned male at birth, still ID as male currently) masquerading as female in an attempt to fool queer women (similar to number 1, but number 1 might include different sorts of lies)

3. cisgendered women (but we reiterate our distaste for this one on multiple levels, please see previous)

4. NOT an excess of (or any?) strictly cosmetic surgical alteration, including altered noses, botox, and/or homogenized teeth

5. no hidden agendas or undisclosed, non-consensual power games

6. regurgitation of "REAL" because it's popular, without much if any actual, well-thought out meaning behind use of the word

If anyone else would like to share a different opinion on what "REAL" means, we're still open to hearing it!

But meanwhile, we're still wondering about some of our original questions, like:

Thinking about whomever you imagine to NOT be "REAL" . . . would they agree with you?

Would anyone that is NOT "REAL" (according the definitions above, or another one (please express that)) agree that that is so?

Or does every human on the planet imagine themselves to be "REAL?"

Any more thoughts appreciated, thanks!

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Got 2 B Real?

I think your best answer there is #6: because of its common usage but then ultimately meaningless because of everyone's thinking that they are real. Not in the metaphysical sense like... Wow. I'm real? but in the "I'm just me! I'm so real!" kind of way.

Of course, I can't really say everyone thinks that way. I do not think I am real at all. I am actually ...

1. a pretty big liar most of the time

2. definitely have a hidden agenda

3. completely filled with botox from head to toe, and

4. not popular enough to be real, except in my own mind where I am the most real and the most cool.

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I too have seen and hear the term "real" many many times. I have even used it a time or two. I may be off but I would like to share my opinion of real, at least as it fits when I use it.

People are constantly trying to be someone. Starting early in life, we learn that in order to have friends, be successful etc, we have to fit into a certain standard set forth by society. Wear the right clothes, listen to the right music, watch the right movies, etc. At some point, many people lose who they are in order to fit the "norm". Often times in relationships, one person will change their thoughts, opinions, feelings, likes, dislikes, etc. to more closely match whoever they happen to be with. The problem is that over time the person you are with is no longer the person you fell for.

I want someone to be an independent thinker. If we do not agree on something, so be it. Stick to your guns. Stand up for what you believe in. If I wanted someone to always agree with me I would seek out those kind of people.

So for me, real is someone who stands up for what they beleive, is honest with themself about their likes and dislikes een if I do not agree and is willing to share the differences rather than always trying to make sure they are liked

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I would say that the term real is being used by most people for the simple fact that it is urban slang. You hear rap artists touting the fact that they are the "realest" and so on. Since it is inevitable that the majority will alter the way they speak to parrot what is presented in popular media, words like this will lose their clarity and take on an ambiguity that more intelligent people will disdain. I would also say, after reading through the thread here, that the word real is a simplification of each and every definition provided here. Some people would rather use the one word than to actually express themselves.

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In retrospect I was a little harsh, wasn't I? An apology is most definitely in order! I seriously didn't mean it as an affront to any person in particular; my thoughts were more geared toward generalities. It is much simpler and quicker to type out the sentence, "I only want real people," than it is to say, "I want someone who is honest, sincere, and who acts with the best of intentions." There are numerous reasons for a person to prefer the shorthand version - laziness, lack of eloquence, or even intentional vagueness for the purpose of casting as wide a net as possible. The list could go on I'm sure, but I believe that the root cause is essentially the same. Either the person cannot or will not take the time to elaborate, and to get her to do so would be the equivalent of pulling teeth.

In answer to a previous question, I believe that most people view themselves as whatever their definition of real is. We each like to think highly enough of ourselves to feel worthy of the attentions of other people, so in terms of tangibility and sincerity most people would believe themselves to be real. Otherwise, what purpose is there in reaching out to other people?

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Actually, by using a single word to try and convey something, we are attempting to neatly label something. Much in the same way that people insist that gender is a binary concept. As I have noted before, it is easier for us to know what it is that we are not looking for than to know what exactly we are looking for. Approaching the issue from this side requires more thought and self searching, but at the same time it would also make our search for that someone(s) easier, because we now have a far more efficient selection process. There are times that binary decision making has its place. A simplistic example is I want apples. If my choices are not apples, then I simply move on. Yes this does eliminate the possibility of exploration and discovery, but there is always a time and place for everything. Perhaps we go through a series of bad choices in order to find out whether or not something can be compatible with ourselves.

As far as hidden agendas go, everyone has at least one. The only time the agenda comes out into the open is when we decide (un)consciously to bring it there. Quite honestly, I have certain dreams that I will never share with anyone. The very pursuit of them makes them hidden agendas. Just because I will not share them does not make them bad or even undesirable. It only makes them what they are-mine. Even though some of us claim to be open books, there is always something that we keep to ourselves. Aperfect example is the original interpretation of the Harry Benjamin Standards. As post-op females, we expected to basically step out of one closet and into another without getting caught. Right or wrong, that was the accepted requirements. After going through all the hoops and hurdles to get SRS, does that make the woman any less "real" than anyone else?For that matter, does it make any person, male or female, that is undergoing treatment for GID any less real because of the procedures involved?

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The utilization of a standard of ‘real’ with assessments of gender is beyond my meager cognitive capacities; now, with a choice of male or female to an inclination of sexual orientation, yes, it is most truly XX or XY (well, most of the time it’s ‘real’). Okay, I can deal with that. But please, allow me to dabble with my conundrum. What is real gender and where can I get some? So, here…… is where I think my confusion begins. Initially, gender appears to me as a social construct, and then follows the convincing arguments that as a general category it is primarily performative (i.e. Judith Butler, Gender Trouble, 1990). So, you may wonder how a transgendered person as myself gets herself to a point of reference; the necessity before the sliver of hope to a sense of reality (my realness?…help me, it is so confusing).

Well where do I begin, it had to be forty years after initial nascent revelations of an identity that has always proven itself so asymmetrical. The short of it is a meager but fortuitous understanding of an internal process that continually establishes a pristine consciousness of my intrinsic gender identity. Via a singularity of events that occur in my life every day, over and over; the perpetual substantiation of becoming….a female. For me, I experience my gender dysphoria as autogynephilia. So, my intrinsic gender identity along with sexual and gender orientations, sexuality, and other axes lead me to construct a performative woman gender identity. Now, is this real? I do not have a clue, but it is me. If someone has a better explanation or answer, please let me know.

To posit the ‘real’ this or that is a great starting point that helps me work with understanding my complicated situation. Of course in this case, I never make it with a final solution, but I get enough of it to get on with my life. Sorry, if I rambled……………………………………………...

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I believe that the usage of the word "real" is based on the assumption that everyone knows what the person is talking about. However, the reality is that when this word is used, nobody is going by the Merriam Webster definition. The only time that "real" ever does get anything resembling a solid definition is when we are actually pressed for clarification. Basically, the usage of "real" is based on a fuzzy definition and fuzzy definitions bring fuzzy results. A stop sign is pretty hard to misinterpret. No matter where one lives, it means the same thing. Unfortunately, our vocabulary does not.

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I think "real" is code for no game players, drama, etc.

But of course the unpleasantries of human relationships won't be magically repelled just by saying we don't want them.

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I will agree with you up to a point regarding the usage of real. However, any human relationship, whether it be friend, mate, or even business partner, is going to have its fair share of games, drama, conflict, good times and times that truly test the strength of the relationship. Drama, like anything else, is unavoidable. Definition #3 from the Merriam-Webster dictionary states that drama is a state, situation, or series of events involving interesting or intense conflict of forces. The previous definitions describe works of art, literature, etc involving the expression of those forces. Granted, this is a course that is unavoidable, but there are also folks who appear to either invite, attract, or create more than what naturally occurs. Given this scenario, does that make the person any less "real" than another? There are certain occupations that can accurately be described as intensely dramatic. EMT's, emergency room personnel, law enforcement of various types, firefighters,etc. Because of the intensity of these occupations, people involved also have a higher relationship failure rate that average. Just because the job may be dramatic, does not mean that the person can keep the job residue completely seperate from the rest of their life. PTSD is a prime example.

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I think the colloquial use of "real" is code talk with relationships, and as such, there is an implicit designation of "I'm" not in this for the drama, games, etc. But I want to find and feel the genuine and authentic.  Albeit easier said than done, there is always the hope that now, Ms. Right is finally in my house.

Hope springs eternal!

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Hey guys! I've read this thread before. But I had no idea what to say about it. Until now! My first lesbotronic friend just used it haha.

Within her context, (I guess I will show her and ask her later, so she can explain it herself) I think she was implying that ...

Dangit. Okay. Context:

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I asked her to Facebook me, and she did. Except, she couldn't see most of my profile, because I forgot that I had a master friend list because of the way I chose to organize my friend lists for my privacy settings. In her e-mail, she inquired about the blank nature of my profile haha. I'm not going to quote exactly, because I didn't ask her permission. But she said something about being wary about meeting people online sometimes and hoping they were real.

-------------------------------

Yeah! So I think you see where I'm going with this! I think those individuals (or a good chunk of them?) who mentioned wanting to only meet real people were possibly running into others who did not appear to be completely honest about themselves (for unknown and probably diverse reasons).

As for a solution, I have no idea. I feel like your questionnaire is comprehensive enough as it is. And that you do a very solid job of filtering out the "wankers" 

But yeah! LOVE YOUR SITE! YOU GUYS ARE AMAZING! KEEP IT UP!!!!!

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I am completely guilty of using this term and not giving much thought to whether or not my audience understood "real" meant to me.

When I used "real" in relation to another person, it meant that they were sincere, straight forward, and honest. The kind of person who will tell it like it is and thinks freely. Somebody who is not superficial, two-faced, or gossipy.

Now that I see how different everyone's idea of what "real" means, I will be more careful with how I use it.

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I get a bit tired of worsmithing myself. I have found in various "dating" sites three types of people; those who have obvously no concern for their personal looks or longevity in this world, kids twenty somethings (no offense) that want to explore, think it's a cool fad to be part of, or people who are completely no where on my list of whom I believe I will be compatible with.

One site completely disgust me, call me old fashioned, I miss that, but it felt more like going int a porn site. Nothing about the person, just their sexual fantasies if you contacted them.

I am new in my area, no offense again, but I am tired of the bar being the only place you can be aassurd to meet gay people, and I make that all inclusive. I know we go to church, bookstores where we can see if we like a book and have a cup of Joe at the same time, movies, etc.

The problem, most cities are not "out" friendly and I honestly believe it impacts the way a person comes across. Without many outlets to let many parts of the personality some out a person is doomed to one and it marks them.

I have heard of cities, as an example, San Diego where I once lived, there was an area of town that was known as being Gay oriented. You had no doubt you were in it, and it was as normal as being in another area of town. No pink flags hanging on the lamp post, rainbow street signs, just gay occuppied with an open invitation to whomever wantd to come there, and no fear all of the merchants were gay operated and owned. You could be out in peace.

However most cities have not transgressed to that point and the ability of someone's surrondings allowing them to become a well rounded individual get trapped by lack of gay freedom.

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I may be missing out but I usually steer clear of user profiles that demand that their potential matches be "real" and "drama free" because:

#1, I am not sure what "real" means... I mean, unless you are a bot, you are real... (whatever the heck that means)

#2, people who love drama rarely advertise this...

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Real means that I have taken the time to put my heat out and answer every question honestly. I don't undestand why people want to be part of meetng frends or a potential signifcaant other by not filling out all information, won't post a picture, and some put thngs n about themselves that are just plain lies. I've been on oter dating sites and will leave it at that, if I thought they were good sites I would still be on them.

Cyber-dating is a risk, te more that is held back just holds that person back from finding companionship and/or friendship.

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Okay I will change my real on my profile even though I am true to myself and others. I get the whole problem with it though. I've also had two long term relationships where they were a dream come true until the first year in and no matter how hard I tried to make it work it takes two. Both relationships the women would rather be glued to mommys hip instead of being equal. One would only come back when she knew I was getting a good bit of money. I'm the moron for that one. I dont just do the dating. I want to date with potential for more. okay off to edit my profile. Is unique acceptable? I have ten piericings in each ear. I'm told I don't behave like society says I should in public. Well age is truly just a number. I'm hyper as hell get very little sleep I want to laugh and I love making others laugh even if it's at my own expense. Okay I've put two responses. I would apologize for being opinionated and long responses but I don't feel I have anything to apologze for. have fun everyone.

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Being "real" is a hard one when you are looking for "love" online. Some people like to fluff up their bio a little because they feel that if they show their true self they will not be accepted est. geek, nerd, not to good looking. I think some people involved in the online dating scene can be a little shallow and that will make others try to build themselves up a little to meet other people shallow needs. In a perfect world we would all find that special person that can see the true inner person, until then we will always have people who are not "real."

I still am real and it has not gotten me to far.

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Hi everyone. There have been a lot of fabulous responses to this topic, and we appreciate that!

But just to steer it back a bit to some of the original questions, if we may:

--

Can someone who is not "REAL" get that way later? What exactly would that entail?

Thinking about whomever you imagine to NOT be "REAL" . . . would they agree with you?

Would anyone that is NOT "REAL" agree that that is so?

Or does every human on the planet imagine themselves to be "REAL?"

--

Any more thoughts on those? :)

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