"So are XX lesbians who exclusively date each other transphobic?"

[lesbotronic]

(Preamble:  We've received more email in response to this and this and initial posts in this section.  We're offering zero guarantee of a personal reply to anyone sending questions via email, especially non-members.  But if we get same or extremely similar more than a few times, we might write about it here just so we can point to this section as a broader reply.

Questions in quotes were asked via email unless otherwise credited.  Some are approximate with same meaning, as we standardized the language and removed some profanity and a few words many consider slurs for clarity, plus a bit more politeness.)

"So are XX lesbians who exclusively date each other transphobic?"

So if you didn't already know:  Back in the day, "gender" (still known as butch/femme) made lots of lesbians happy . . . which led to lots of sex? 

It's a sorting method still popular within groups of XX already willing to funk with each other.  Within lesbianism, gender doesn’t insist XX also has to funk with XY just because XY wants to funk if XX doesn't want to funk with XY too.

It also didn't deny anyone's biological sex or the sexually dimorphic nature of human reality.

Today's gender isn't just for lesbians anymore after morphing into a hierarchy of sexism, with XY back over XX at the top of the privilege totem.  So this supposedly fresh new sexism is really just the same old we've seen throughout human history, reconstituted then deceptively relabeled all over again, this time . . . "gender ideology."

Unsurprisingly, today's gender highly correlates with less sex IRL and fewer sexually-connected, emotionally gratifying offline relationships. 

. . . 

"So are XX lesbians who exclusively date each other transphobic?"

"Your lesbianism is not diverse and equitable and inclusive if you don't include me just because I'm a man!  That's discrimination, and it's wrong!"

"If your lesbianism isn't intersectional enough to include male lesbians, it should be illegal!"

"My penis isn't a penis unless I say so.  I say oversized clitoris!  Or she-nis!  If you still say penis, the ACLU now says genocide."

"Do not call the lesbians who have sex with my penis bisexual!  They are still 100% lesbian because lesbians validate my identity."

"If you say you do not wish to date me because of my penis, you're obliterating my entire identity and denying my right to exist.  How could you be so cruel?"

"If lesbians who were privileged enough to be born genetically and physically female only want to date each other, how do you think that makes men feel?"

 

 

"Think of all the emotional labor that requires: planning each of your actions and weighing them against the emotional consequences they might have on every person, and bending yourself in anticipation of what others might feel — always scaling back your own desires and rejecting your own needs. It requires a constant negotiation of what you can say and do in the world, constantly diminishing yourself because of the effect it might have on other people — which you cannot actually control or predict."

 

Meanwhile, it's rare that men are expected to be incredibly accommodating and nurturing, even with their own biological children.

But women are now expected to "affirm" everyone they encounter, including random men in their periphery in whom they're apparently no longer allowed to be merely uninterested?

 

 

Men are More Afraid Than Ever by Lili Loofbourow
(The Best American Essays 2019 (The Best American Series ®) (p. 148). HMH Books. Kindle Edition.)

"It’s not that men’s pain isn’t real; it’s that our culture vastly overestimates it. A certain kind of man not getting exactly what he wants, precisely when he wants it, will truly believe he’s suffering more than a woman in pain who has never been told that what she wants might matter. While this doesn’t make him a liar, it does limit him and blind him to those limits. 

It’s as if men and women have different pain scales, emotionally as well as physically. Of course men believe they suffer more, and many women—having spent their lives accustomed to men’s feelings mattering more than everyone else’s—will agree with them. Most of us have been socialized to sympathize with men, the troubled geniuses, the heroes and antiheroes. They’re the protagonists."

. . .

Some XYs out there need my sexuality to be equitable and inclusive enough to always include their penises, and instruct other lesbians to include their penises too!  Or I'm a bigot!

Gay men are fine though!  

(Because they're still men, obviously.)

Also, when an XY wants to date a gay man he obviously already can, so no problem there.

Sexism says you can't exclude an XY from anything in general, and "queer" specifically says not even from your own sex life.  

Gay men are still fine because men get to define their own sexuality!

Plus bonus?!  The only group gay men are excluding are XXs!   No one cares about that!

So excluding XX vaginas from your sexuality?  That's just your identity, which is perfectly legit because it includes your personal private sexual preferences, which are obviously beyond reproach.  

But for an XX to reject penises from her own sex life exactly the same way?  

Then she's probably a bigot, say many sexist XY who have always rejected penises from their own sex lives exactly the same way.  

But because they're XY that's forever allowed.  For them.

. . . 

 

"According to gender ideology, any XY possessing all stereotypical XY characteristics is allowed to "identify as" a lesbian any other lesbian should want to date, and no lesbian is ever allowed to disagree?

If she disagrees even a wee bit, even just for herself, according to mens' rights activism she's a bigot and a transphobe.  She's too unkind to join the rest of the queer community on the right side of history!"

 

And . . . the constant social pressure upon women to be "kind" is highly correlated with denial of both biology and common sense.   Particularly in the "queer community," lately with more rampant sexism.

Gay men are allowed to have social gatherings where they are not required to pretend they will ever consider having sex with a vagina.  These are not only allowed, they're "queer" enough to be celebrated. 

Do you need any more convincing this is sexism?  Watch who's allowed to say no to "gender ideology" without getting bullied or shamed.

 

For many women, the sexism of gender ideology encouraged us to go along just to get along to win everyone's "queer" approval, extra especially dominant men.
 
But then one day the lightbulbs finally started going off and we were like, "Um.  WHAT?"

 

"The idea that lesbians are transphobic because our sexual boundaries do not extend to accommodate penis is a phallocentric fallacy. And the pressure on lesbians to redefine those boundaries is frankly terrifying – it rests on an attitude of entitlement towards women’s bodies, an entitlement that is part of patriarchy and now being replicated within queer space. Lesbian women do not exist as sex objects or sources of validation, but self-actualised human beings with desires and boundaries of our own."

"Talking about queer politics with gay male friends my age is something of an eye-opener. I am reminded of two things: With men, no is accepted as the closing word. With women, no is treated as the opening of a negotiation. Most gay men in my life are in turns horrified and amused by the notion that the parameters of their sexuality could or should be expected to move in accordance with the dictates of queer politics. Some (the fortunate ones – ignorance here is bliss) are unfamiliar with the rabbit hole of queer theory. Others (the newly initiated) are, unsurprisingly, resistant to the queer problematising of homosexuality. One went so far as to suggest gays, lesbians, and bisexuals break away from the alphabet soup of queer politics and self-organise specifically around the lines of sexuality – given that numerous dykes have been  subject to the TERF witch-hunt for making the same case, it was at once uplifting and depressing to hear a man outside of radical feminism voice the same views without fear of censure."

"Some things haven’t changed a great deal. Lesbian sexuality is still routinely degraded. Lesbian women are still the posterdykes for “don’t worry, I’m not that type of feminist.” Only now, when I check my Twitter notifications, it genuinely takes a moment to work out whether my being a lesbian has offended the alt-right or the queer left. Does it particularly matter? The lesbophobia takes the same format. The hatred of women is identical."

 

....

Again, since we're still receiving questions and also again because we already said so over here more in depth:  According to our stats, IF "transphobia" within lesbotronic is defined as:

lack of desire to date a trans woman/XY lesbian, as stated on profile questionnaire

 . . . then which demographic is most transphobic?

Trans women calling themselves lesbian are most transphobic.  On lesbotronic, they've mostly avoided each other while stating a desire to friend or date XX lesbians instead.

The overwhelming majority of XY lesbians who have ever signed up wish to meet XX lesbians, not each other.  Most have never wished to date according to gender, only biological sex, in that they're clear they prefer XX.

XX lesbians always want to friend or date other XX lesbians, extremely reliably so, almost all of the time.

XX bisexual women are least transphobic, with approximately 25% willing to date a trans woman.  It's the exact same percentage willing to date a trans man.  If they're open to anyone trans at all, they usually pick both XX and XY at the same time.

XX lesbians and trans men (still XX) are in the middle.  Our older age groups of XX lesbians are a bit more willing to date a trans woman than the younger ones, not the other way around, as some have suggested.  

 

SO:  According to everything we're aware of via board stats interaction on our site, the profiles ever in our database, and the relationships reported, trans women calling themselves lesbian will have much better results trying to form any relationship with an XX who calls herself some variety of bisexual rather than lesbian.

Obviously this makes sense to us.  

But it makes a lot less for sexists who would rather deny XX lesbians who exclusively date each other the right to exist as a distinct demographic group.

 

"... lesbians are not attracted to the sex role stereotypes (also known as gender) ascribed to those people assigned-female-at-birth. We are attracted to females. This is why a woman who loves women is likely to date women all over the spectrum of hair lengths, preferred heel heights, ability to use tools, ability to make dinner, and preferred amount of makeup throughout her lifetime. Sure, we might have a type (mine is tall women with high-and-tights who ride motorcycles and have major planets in fire signs — DM me), but most women would not say that what they are looking for in a partner is a predilection (or lack thereof) for eyeliner. This also explains why so many lesbians love females who have or will eventually transition to living as transmen."

"Women are both very sexual creatures and capable of being sexually discriminating. Our sexual practices are diverse: juicy, libidinous, kinky, vanilla, stone, cuddly, intellectual, poetic, and political. They are erotic and embodied. If you think they don’t involve touching, tasting, and loving the female body, you may have fallen prey to the patriarchal belief that women’s bodies are disgusting. Queer culture makes all sorts of room for people whose sexual practice centers around wearing diapers, coercive weight gain, and Grindr, but apparently wanting to bury your face in pussy is what Dan Savage would call “a fetish too far.”"

 

Which is staggering obviously transparently the point for many sexist XY.  

But everyone else could just stop.